Post Reply  Post Thread 
Pages (5): « First < Previous 1 [2] 3 4 5 Next > Last »

Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

Author Message
Rising Phoenix
Unregistered


Post: #11
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

I think this posted this somewhere around the forum as well. Either way, I found it quite spot-on: http://www.bugmartini.com/comic/exasperated-egyptian/

As for myself, I tend to be skeptic to such things because really, why would aliens need to build things like pyramids and never return. Suspect

07.03.2014 23:01
Quote this message in a reply
Helsworth
Heathen
****


Posts: 8,854
Words count: 1,597,451
Group: Super Moderators
Joined: Nov2008
Status: Offline
Reputation: 146
Experience: 859
Glory Points: 260
Medals: 11

Post: #12
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

Rising Phoenix Wrote:
As for myself, I tend to be skeptic to such things because really, why would aliens need to build things like pyramids and never return. Suspect

Well, the suggestion that those ancient aliens are in fact, neither gods, nor "space-men", but advanced human beings possessing high-tech shit is more plausible. Of course, the guys in the series are all over the place with their explanations - and it gets frustrating and boring when all you see is belief backed arguments, and nothing else.


https://www.patreon.com/SerbanVCEnache

This post was last modified: 07.03.2014 23:10 by Helsworth.

07.03.2014 23:09
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Rising Phoenix
Unregistered


Post: #13
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

Helsworth Wrote:
Well, the suggestion that those ancient aliens are in fact, neither gods, nor "space-men", but advanced human beings possessing high-tech shit is more plausible.

As I see it, it just as plausible as everything else. I would prefer the "space-men" vs. "humans from another planet". There is too much correlation between native species and humans D.N.A.. And if you say that native species are also "imported", well, let us just say that is jumping deeper into the belief pool.

Helsworth Wrote:
Of course, the guys in the series are all over the place with their explanations - and it gets frustrating and boring when all you see is belief backed arguments, and nothing else.

I understand their enthusiasm. I can see why, had many of these constructions been of a greater complexity and resources not found elsewhere on Earth I would actually support them.

But, the article Bakto posted is certain about one thing: We have never meet live, intelligent aliens. Not even their remains. I think it is premature to say we have been visited at any point in time -- let alone that they took part in our development.

08.03.2014 00:29
Quote this message in a reply
Nietzsche
Unregistered


Post: #14
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

I guess we should never rule out the possibility that we are the first. I know many people wouldn't like the idea, but reviewing what we know now and relying on it, a few things can be stated.

The odds of intelligent life developing are very slim.

Even the multiverse theory backs this. If only one or maybe a few physical constants would be off only by small numbers, our whole Universe housing us might not have been able to even create the most basic bricks we need, let alone begin to exist.

When a star goes Nova (which must have happened to what was in our area before the sun, since we have very heavy elements on earth) a nebula is what remains. The odds of parts of that nebula slowly forming what we have as earth today, with all the elements needed to create us, again, are very slim.

And that leaves out the billions and billions of years of evolution still. What I want to say is, the Universe is vast and there are numerous starts, uncountale even. But the odds for life as we know it (as we are) coming of existence is so small it rules out the vast number.


The Universe is approx ~14 billion years old. Our sun is 4 billion years old and will be there for another 4. That is important. Most starts are bigger, and burn out after only a few million years. That is not enough time for life to develop like it did here. Other stars are ancient and very small, but do not generate enough energy or too much radiation for life.

Thus, we might be the first. We don't meet any others, because we will be the first ones to venture out one day, if it is possible to break the lightspeed barrier at all.

09.03.2014 15:10
Quote this message in a reply
BaktoMakhno
Looter
*


Posts: 1,058
Words count: 245,068
Group: Basic
Joined: Mar2011
Status: Offline
Reputation: 39
Experience: 496
Glory Points: 10
Medals: 1

Post: #15
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

There would be no need for faster than light travel for intelligent life to colonize the galaxy.

Nick Bostrom Wrote:
Our galaxy is about 100,000 light-years across. If a probe were capable of traveling at one-tenth the speed of light, every planet in the galaxy could thus be colonized within a couple of million years (allowing some time for each probe that lands on a resource site to set up the necessary infrastructure and produce daughter probes). If travel speed were limited to 1 percent of light speed, colonization might take 20 million years instead. The exact numbers do not matter much, because the timescales are at any rate very short compared with the astronomical ones on which the evolution of intelligent life occurs.


I would like the idea that we are the first evolution of intelligent life. So would Nick Bostrom and most people who think about this sort of stuff. Rather than saying that the odds of intelligent life developing are slim, it would be more accurate to say:

The odds of intelligent life getting to the point where we would see evidence of it are very slim

Seeing as the universe is so vast, some step in the necessary course of events for extraterrestrial life to develop to the point where we would have observed evidence of it, must not just be improbable, but astronomically so. Now this step may be behind us. It may also be in front of us. I'm hoping for the former, but given what we know about climate change (not to mention several other methods we have developed for killing ourselves) my gut is going with the latter.

It does not seem that the formation of earth like planets (or moons) around sun like stars is all that rare an event. Doubly so as gas giants are much easier to detect than earth like planets. I really don't think this is anywhere near unlikely enough to be a plausible candidate for our great filter. Very heavy elements are not important in life.

wiki Wrote:
Data from the Habitable Exoplanets Catalog (HEC) suggests that, of the 859 exoplanets which have been confirmed as of 3 January 2013, nine potentially habitable planets have been found, and the same source predicts that there may be 30 habitable extrasolar moons around confirmed planets. The HEC also states that of the 15,874 transit threshold crossing events (TCE) which have recurred more than three times (thus making them more likely to be actual planets), discovered by the Kepler probe up until 3 January 2013, that 262 planets (1.65%) have the potential to be habitable, with an additional 35 "warm jovian" planets which may have habitable natural satellites.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exoplanet#Habitability


"The beauty of free trade is that 1 and 1 can be 3" - Titian

"There is no conversation more boring than one where Globaltom speaks" - Triniterias

This post was last modified: 09.03.2014 16:50 by BaktoMakhno.

09.03.2014 16:41
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Rising Phoenix
Unregistered


Post: #16
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

Indeed, I agree.

It is entirely possible that somewhere else there are already alien cultures. However, what if they are still in early stages of technological development? They would not even be leave to send objects out of their planet, thus we would not even know they were intelligent until we actually studied them.

09.03.2014 16:52
Quote this message in a reply
BaktoMakhno
Looter
*


Posts: 1,058
Words count: 245,068
Group: Basic
Joined: Mar2011
Status: Offline
Reputation: 39
Experience: 496
Glory Points: 10
Medals: 1

Post: #17
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

Thing is, given the timescales involved, it is far, far, far more likely for intelligent life to have developed before us rather than just at the same (or slightly later) time than us. That is if it is likely to have happened at all. The universe is about 14 billion (10^9) years old. By contrast humans have only been around for a few hundred thousand years. And even with low C fractional travel speed it would only take several million years to colonize the galaxy.

Technological development happened in the blink of an eye in terms of evolutionary timescales.
There many happier explanation for our lack of observable alien evidence. That sufficiently intelligent life naturally tends to overcome the tendency to spread like a weed common to simpler life, or that it chooses to assume a non-physical form through so as yet unknown physics - but I wouldn't count on it.


"The beauty of free trade is that 1 and 1 can be 3" - Titian

"There is no conversation more boring than one where Globaltom speaks" - Triniterias

This post was last modified: 09.03.2014 17:04 by BaktoMakhno.

09.03.2014 17:02
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Rising Phoenix
Unregistered


Post: #18
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

My personal take on it is that this is a case where physics > mathematics.

We know that, given the time that has transcurred since the emergence of the universe (Big Bang, etc.) that many alien species should have developed. However, we have seen no evidence of this. Therefore, aliens haven not reached such stages of development for a reason -- we simply have to find it.

And let us not forget that we might as well have won the lottery. I think the idea that Ancients/Reapers/Old Ones/etc. destroy space-faring species is a cheap cliché. But the fact that we may be the first species to have developed means of space travel -- particularly in our galaxy -- still exists, however small.

Also, that is a point I forgot to make before: Yes, you do not need faster-than-light travel to reach different systems between a single galaxy. Reaching a whole different galaxy, however, is a different thing. You could very well have aliens out there more advanced than us, but if they are five hundred galaxies away we are likely to never meet them.

09.03.2014 17:25
Quote this message in a reply
Nietzsche
Unregistered


Post: #19
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

BaktoMakhno Wrote:
There would be no need for faster than light travel for intelligent life to colonize the galaxy.

Nick Bostrom Wrote:
Our galaxy is about 100,000 light-years across. If a probe were capable of traveling at one-tenth the speed of light, every planet in the galaxy could thus be colonized within a couple of million years (allowing some time for each probe that lands on a resource site to set up the necessary infrastructure and produce daughter probes). If travel speed were limited to 1 percent of light speed, colonization might take 20 million years instead. The exact numbers do not matter much, because the timescales are at any rate very short compared with the astronomical ones on which the evolution of intelligent life occurs.


This is true, but the makers of that perticular theory often take it a step further and ask whether any civilization would launch such probes. It would be a low-priority mission at best, since the outcome would not be viewable by many, many generations, given that an alient race does have a comparable lifespan to ours. It is possible, yes, but it makes no sense.

09.03.2014 17:52
Quote this message in a reply
Rising Phoenix
Unregistered


Post: #20
RE: Ancient Aliens/Astronauts (fun and interesting stuff )

Nietzsche Wrote:
This is true, but the makers of that perticular theory often take it a step further and ask whether any civilization would launch such probes. It would be a low-priority mission at best, since the outcome would not be viewable by many, many generations, given that an alient race does have a comparable lifespan to ours. It is possible, yes, but it makes no sense.

Also, it is a secondary lottery check here:

Civilization A launches probe to a distant star.
Civilization B needs receive A's probe to know that A exists.
Therefore B needs to be in the pathway of A's prove or otherwise encounter such probe before it ends up destroying itself due to decay/crashing somewhere/etcetera.

What is to say that there is not, out there, another civilization which has sent it's own "Viking" into space, but has yet to find ours - and vice versa? Kopfkratz

09.03.2014 19:27
Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply  Post Thread 

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread: Author Replies: Views: Last Post
Smile Interesting Theolor 2 1,087 15.10.2015 03:01
Last Post: yangusbeef
  Joe Rogan and Dave Foley, on NewsRadio, the past and crazy stuff Helsworth 0 1,391 21.04.2015 19:59
Last Post: Helsworth
  Ants are the most extraordinary aliens alive! Helsworth 11 1,988 21.03.2013 06:39
Last Post: Burz
  Proposal for a new AR tradition pirated from ancient Rome Titian 2 1,191 12.12.2012 06:32
Last Post: Titian
  Ancient Aliens and Cowboys Helsworth 15 2,863 04.05.2012 20:41
Last Post: Helsworth
  Interesting stats about sexual behaviour Unkas 0 1,266 19.05.2011 19:22
Last Post: Unkas

View a Printable Version
Send this Thread to a Friend
Subscribe to this Thread | Add Thread to Favorites

Forum Jump: