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Obama v Romney

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Rising Phoenix
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Post: #41
RE: Obama v Romney

MarcusAquila Wrote:
They are not always right but I prefer a State Dept controlled by experts and professionals than officials more worried about their re-election (just look at how Obama skipped the UN General Convention for interviews with rappers and the View, its disgraceful, irresponsible, and dangerous).

Would you be kind enough to define "expert" and "professional"?

11.10.2012 19:23
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MarcusAquila
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Post: #42
RE: Obama v Romney

Quote:
Would you be kind enough to define "expert" and "professional"?


Since most Americans do not have time to be informed about all global events and barely enough time to be familiar with even the big ones, you need a professional class of diplomats and foreign service officers.

By professional I mean someone who is well-trained, educated for a particular role (such as an economic analyst for the State Dept.).
By Expert I mean someone who has spent many years and is "fluent" in a culture and very familiar with how that culture thinks and operates.

The problem with voting for ambassadors is that, yes, high tarriffs sound good to most people in the middle-class (protects domestic businesses) it is bad international and economic policy. But most people won't research tariffs and their effects. They'll just listen to the demagogues and populists. When you have a class of people devoted to international issues and policy, immune to elections and the corruption that democracy brings to the table, you get better policies than if your ambassadors were elected and had to make sure all their decisions were popular (even if they weren't in the best interests of the nation as a whole). Just like congressmen spend more time in reelection campaigns and finding financiers so too would ambassadors spend more time on election and less time on diplomacy.

Also, what is a compelling argument FOR the election of ambassadors? Do most American or even Europeans know the complexities of Middle Eastern politics? Or the major concerns of the people in Indonesia? I think not. So why let such people be in charge of choosing who will construct policy with these nations unless of course your devotion to "democracy" blinds your reason.


The hand of the aggressor is stayed by strength and strength alone.
Gen. Dwight Eisenhower

I am in earnest – I will not equivocate – I will not excuse – I will not retreat a single inch – AND I WILL BE HEARD.
William Lloyd Garrison
11.10.2012 19:51
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Helsworth
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Post: #43
RE: Obama v Romney

MarcusAquila Wrote:
Also, what is a compelling argument FOR the election of ambassadors? Do most American or even Europeans know the complexities of Middle Eastern politics? Or the major concerns of the people in Indonesia? I think not. So why let such people be in charge of choosing who will construct policy with these nations unless of course your devotion to "democracy" blinds your reason.

Neither do the appointed ambassadors. They're sent there by the lobbying machine, and consequently they represent those interests - which have nothing to do with national interest, but everything to do with maintaining a favorable commercial status quo for the banksters and big business. The banking system was run by the foremost experts in their respective fields: trading, finance, marketing et all. They still held hostage entire sovereign nation states and managed to swindle the citizens, without inquiring loses - on the contrary, still maintaining their bonuses and fraudulent activities without even being audited. It doesn't matter if you possess a lot of knowledge or little knowledge, if you're a devil, you're a devil. The smarter the devil - the more clever it is.


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This post was last modified: 11.10.2012 20:46 by Helsworth.

11.10.2012 20:00
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Rising Phoenix
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Post: #44
RE: Obama v Romney

MarcusAquila Wrote:
By professional I mean someone who is well-trained, educated for a particular role (such as an economic analyst for the State Dept.).

Ok.

MarcusAquila Wrote:
By Expert I mean someone who has spent many years and is "fluent" in a culture and very familiar with how that culture thinks and operates.

So by this definition you need an Iranian-American to deal with Iran. Nice. But if you believe such a person is more capable than you about dealing with Iran, why are you talking about the path the United States should take when dealing with Iran?

11.10.2012 20:57
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MarcusAquila
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Post: #45
RE: Obama v Romney

Quote:
So by this definition you need an Iranian-American to deal with Iran. Nice. But if you believe such a person is more capable than you about dealing with Iran, why are you talking about the path the United States should take when dealing with Iran


That is not true. My definition said "fluent" not "actually a member of." While yes, it would be wonderfully helpful for Iranian-Americans to work in the State Dept, if they have family in Iran, Iranian police/officials may threaten those family members and force the Iranian-Americans to commit acts of treason. However, there are Americans who can speak Farsi and who are familiar with Iran's culture and government who can also carry out international policy with Iran so there is no need to jeaporadize the lives of Iranian-Americans' families currently in Iran or in pro-Iranian countries like Syria.

I am not sure what you mean by "why are you talking about the path the US should take when dealing with Iran."


The hand of the aggressor is stayed by strength and strength alone.
Gen. Dwight Eisenhower

I am in earnest – I will not equivocate – I will not excuse – I will not retreat a single inch – AND I WILL BE HEARD.
William Lloyd Garrison
11.10.2012 23:16
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Rising Phoenix
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Post: #46
RE: Obama v Romney

Perhaps our definition of "fluent" is different. I speak English fluently, for example. I am capable of talking about English culture? Not that at all, the only thing I know about modern U.K. are several scant facts.

12.10.2012 00:26
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MarcusAquila
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Post: #47
RE: Obama v Romney

By fluent I meant versed, familiar, "initiated" if you will. Essentially, an ideal foreign service worker/officer would know the language very well and have a solid understanding of the culture (maybe through having grown up there or married to a person from there or having visited that area many times).
I had a French teacher who was American, so were her husband and family. Yet, she spent most of her life in Nice, France. Even when she "lived" in the states, she spent all her summers and holidays in Nice. In my State Dept. she would be working with my embassy in France as her knowledge of the language, customs and culture make her a valuable asset in constructing diplomatic ties and furthering American interests in France.


The hand of the aggressor is stayed by strength and strength alone.
Gen. Dwight Eisenhower

I am in earnest – I will not equivocate – I will not excuse – I will not retreat a single inch – AND I WILL BE HEARD.
William Lloyd Garrison
12.10.2012 00:30
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Snorunt30
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Post: #48
RE: Obama v Romney

Forgot to post this a few days ago, but what did you guys think of the Ryan and Biden debate (since they are related to this topic as well, being the VP/potential VP and all)? (better late than never Hehe)


Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem.
(By the sword we seek peace, but peace only under Liberty.)
If the opposite of pro is con, what is the opposite of progress?
Congress.

This post was last modified: 13.10.2012 23:02 by Snorunt30.

13.10.2012 23:02
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Globaltom
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Suedparadies
Post: #49
RE: Obama v Romney

Well Ryan was deffinitly stronger than Palin
4 years ago, but also is more an econimic but less
foreign expert.
Biden not really make himself a benefit that
with his smiling or answering bring Ryan in an
young boy position, because that looks less resonable.
What maybee beings a pluspont that in the foreign
topics Iran and Afghanistan Biden brings Ryan in
an pro war position that well was nearly a trapp.


Briefwähler
14.10.2012 16:28
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MarcusAquila
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Post: #50
RE: Obama v Romney

I found Biden to be annoying and unprofessional. He did not act like a vice president and I became even more disappointed in him. Also, he made outrageous statements and used little facts in his arguments (or rather personal jabs).
Ryan was too factual, he didn't make a good appeal to people, just their brains (and we know how many people use those today). If he'd been more conversational when he used his facts it would have been a better performance for him.

Overall, it doesn't matter what I think but what the people at large think. Most agree that Biden did well but he still lost to Ryan. Of course Republicans were hoping for a more... brilliant performance on the part of Ryan to help continue the high they've been riding on for the past week or so but this has only served to make Tuesday's debate all the more fascinating.


The hand of the aggressor is stayed by strength and strength alone.
Gen. Dwight Eisenhower

I am in earnest – I will not equivocate – I will not excuse – I will not retreat a single inch – AND I WILL BE HEARD.
William Lloyd Garrison
14.10.2012 22:56
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